Shoptalk Europe 2025: TikTok Shop Dominates, AI Gets Agentic & Store Teams Win Big
Fresh from the buzzing halls of Shoptalk Europe in Barcelona, the Omni Talk team delivers a rapid-fire breakdown of the biggest retail trends shaping the future live from the conference stage with Shoptalk's very own Ben Miller and Adam Plom.
From TikTok Shop's explosive growth (seriously, it's everywhere) to the rise of agentic AI that's already saving Amazon $200 million annually, this episode covers the tech, strategies, and insights that had everyone talking while eating tapas down the aisles of the Barcelona convention center.
Discover why European business confidence is holding steady despite global uncertainty, how Google's new "Try It On" feature is revolutionizing online shopping, and why investing in your store teams might be the smartest move you make this year.
Plus, hear why Harrods turns OFF their AI when buyers select merchandise, the surprising demographics shopping on TikTok, and how Mars is shifting 70% of their media spend to digital.
Whether you're navigating the complexity of social commerce, implementing new store technologies, or trying to balance engagement with efficiency, this episode delivers actionable insights direct from one of the best conferences out there.
The retail landscape is evolving faster than ever – make sure you're keeping up.
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Transcript
Hello, welcome, Shop Talk Europe.
Speaker A:How's everybody doing?
Speaker A:Are you alive?
Speaker A:Maybe like a clap or anything?
Speaker A:No.
Speaker A:All right, all right, all right.
Speaker A:Well, thank you so much for being here.
Speaker A:I'm Anne Mazinga.
Speaker A:I'm one of the co founders, along with Chris Walton here of amitalk Retail.
Speaker A:We are a podcast network based out of the US and we focus on the people, the companies and the technologies that are shaping the future future of retail.
Speaker A:And I don't know if you realize, but we're recording a live podcast right now, which is why I wanted you guys to clap, so that people realize there are actually people in the audience here and it's not just the four of us talking to ourselves, which would be fine too.
Speaker A:Well, those listening obviously know Chris and I.
Speaker A:As I mentioned, we have the Amitak Retail podcast, the only retail podcast that's in apples top 100 business podcasts.
Speaker A:So check it out if you haven't already.
Speaker A:But I'd love to take a moment quickly to introduce for all of you in the audience and those listening at home, the real retail experts and the people who've been behind all of the incredible content that we've been here to witness at Shop Talk Europe for the last two days.
Speaker A:And that is Adam Plom and Ben Miller.
Speaker A:Ben Miller for those.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker A:I think so.
Speaker B:Two applauses.
Speaker B:Well, two applauses.
Speaker A:Adam, it's your first time time and you've already got two applauses.
Speaker A:I know you're winning.
Speaker B:This is too good.
Speaker C:It's only downhill from here completely.
Speaker A:Let me first introduce Ben.
Speaker A:If you're meeting him for the first time, he's Shoptalk's Vice President of Original content and strategy.
Speaker A:And in this role, he works with internal teams and external research partners to lead the creation of content across Shoptalk's global portfolio.
Speaker A:Adam Plum is the Vice President of Content for Shop Talk Europe.
Speaker A:And Adam and his team are responsible for defining and delivering the strategic content vision for the show, researching and writing the agenda, and identifying and acquiring best in class speakers.
Speaker A:So if you have any complaints, you can go to Adam, but hopefully you have more positive comments to share as well.
Speaker A:Right?
Speaker B:That would be good.
Speaker A:Well, before we get started, just a quick overview of how this session runs.
Speaker A:So this is a rapid fire session, which means that we're going to break down each of the takeaways from the last three days of content and we only have four minutes to do that in each category.
Speaker A:If we are still talking and we hit four minutes, you're going to hear a loud buzzer.
Speaker A:It will not be as loud as the alarm that came from your phone at 10am but it is a little startling.
Speaker A:So just beware.
Speaker A:All right, let's have Adam, before we get started, give us a quick overview of kind of the themes coming into Shop Talk Europe to set the table.
Speaker B:Well, I think we have a number of themes and it feels like at the end of three days, you feel like you've discussed absolutely everything that's that's taken place.
Speaker B:But we did have kind of four clearly defined themes this year.
Speaker B:So there was generating value across unified commerce.
Speaker B:We were looking at inspiring and driving search and discovery and capturing attention.
Speaker B:And of the consumer, we were looking at the future of in store experiences in an increasingly digital age.
Speaker B:So the experience side and the efficiency side and then we were looking at business model evolution, retail, media, re commerce.
Speaker A:Okay, well, let's kick it off with the first question here.
Speaker A:I'm going to set the clock at four minutes.
Speaker A:All right, here we go.
Speaker A:First question.
Speaker A:How is European business confidence holding up?
Speaker D:So I think it's a couple of reflections, really.
Speaker D:So first is reflection on the show.
Speaker D:It's been such a fun and interesting three days, really vibrant.
Speaker D:I think it's felt really dynamic.
Speaker D:It's felt really energetic, which has been great.
Speaker D:And it's really important to separate just for a moment how it's felt in these four walls with some of the broader things that are going on.
Speaker D:So we started on Monday.
Speaker D:Monday afternoon feels a lifetime ago, but it was wonderful.
Speaker D:We had a number of presentations to help set the scene.
Speaker D:And we invited MasterCard's chief economist, Natalia, who does that for Europe, to give us a statistical view, to retell us, okay, what was going on with business and consumer confidence.
Speaker D:And a couple of things that she called out was the euro is pretty strong.
Speaker D:Euro is doing okay.
Speaker D:Stock, the market is volatile, but largely recovered from recent challenges.
Speaker D:Commodity energy prices are going down in Europe.
Speaker D:There is still inflationary pressures, but they're sort of netting out consumer purchasing power off the back of a lot of that is on the way up.
Speaker D:So a number of the macroeconomic conditions are actually okay.
Speaker D:So it's kind of solid.
Speaker D:It's not exciting, but it's okay.
Speaker D:The, the challenge that we're facing into is the consumer confidence.
Speaker D:Looking the consumer confidence has taken a real hit.
Speaker D:So all of the uncertainty, tariffs, trade, et cetera has really hit consumer confidence.
Speaker D:And it's not even across Europe, certain countries, Switzerland, for example, has taken a big hit and that is pulling back business confidence.
Speaker D:So business confidence statistically is down.
Speaker D:It's down a bit, not hugely.
Speaker D:I think Europe's in a better place that from those perspectives than in the US but the overall consumer conditions for now are looking okay.
Speaker D:So I think that's the statistical view.
Speaker D:I mean, the conversations that I've heard and some of the topics I've heard have been around managing agility and the leadership required.
Speaker D:And we can come back to that.
Speaker D:The difficulty in planning and increased short term horizons for planning and, and also managing price fluctuations and how you can get the tools and the tech in place.
Speaker D:The tools and the tech are out there to be able to analyze and respond to pricing changes quicker than ever.
Speaker D:But actually getting those tools into the business when you need them now is the challenge.
Speaker D:So I think that would be my overview, but with 130 left, I'm gonna stop talking.
Speaker A:Adam, what about you?
Speaker A:What were some of the things that you noticed?
Speaker B:Well, I think for me there's definitely a theme of certainty.
Speaker B:Uncertainty is the only certainty.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Everyone's just grappling with whether it's macroeconomic, whether it's wars, whether it's tariffs, whether it's shutdowns, volatility.
Speaker B:Volatility is just, it's just everywhere.
Speaker B:And I think that kind of came through in a couple of conversations.
Speaker B:And one panelist on our supply chain session kind of referred to feeling like they're living through just mini pandemics at the moment.
Speaker B:I think, you know, Covid helped equip certain brands with certain things, but now it's like short term bursts of, of massive disruption.
Speaker B:And so looking long, long term is quite tricky.
Speaker B:But trying to also make sure that any short term decision is still anchored in that long term strategy is quite challenging too.
Speaker B:So I think that's a key.
Speaker B:Watch out for some.
Speaker B:So I think agility and responsiveness and adaptability have been probably pretty high up on our word count this week, but it seems to come through the buzzword of the conference.
Speaker B:Yeah, I think so.
Speaker A:Chris, any last comments?
Speaker C:Yeah, I mean, I think I'd sum up what you both said with what was probably my favorite quote of the show.
Speaker C:It was from Harrod CEO when he gave his keynote.
Speaker C:And I think I might be paraphrasing this, but it's pretty close.
Speaker C:But he said, quote, it's really hard to predict even three years out, which shows me that there is a crack in executive confidence at even his level.
Speaker C:And I think that's from two factors.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:If we step back, it's macroeconomic for sure.
Speaker C:You know, give or take.
Speaker C:What's happening in The US is definitely having an impact, whatever you want to think of that.
Speaker C:And then lastly, in the 7 seconds I have, AI is also a part of that, like in terms of how it's changing how we work as a business, which I think is also hard to predict.
Speaker C:All right, next up, next up, right under the bell, huh?
Speaker C:Yeah, nailed it.
Speaker C:All right, so what is going on with search and also, if you want to talk about it, discovery.
Speaker C:Adam, let's go back to you.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Well, this is interesting because I think we covered this in a big way at Shop Talk Spring in Las Vegas and that conversation has moved on already.
Speaker B:I think the rate of change in that time has been, has been huge.
Speaker B:So going into the show, we knew that this was kind of a rapid moving space.
Speaker B:And yesterday we had our sort of main sort of session on this topic and it was packed, the whole room was full.
Speaker B:It's clearly front of mind for so many people right now.
Speaker B:We had L' Oreal, we had Vault, and we had TikTok shop.
Speaker B:So hugely popular topic.
Speaker B:I think it's.
Speaker B:From our perspective, it's two things.
Speaker B:One, it's the continued rise of social commerce really changing how people discover products, where they search for products.
Speaker B:And the second thing which we alluded to quite heavily in Zeitgeist is, you know, AI driven search.
Speaker B:Whether that's generative, whether that's agentic AI.
Speaker B:You know, we talked about the potential possibility of that.
Speaker B:But you know, every day, every week now, you're seeing big tech announcing new features, new capabilities, moving more and more towards kind of this commerce, you know, AI agentic enabled commerce world that we're moving to.
Speaker B:So I think they're the kind of the two big things.
Speaker B:But I think from.
Speaker B:For me, what I found most interesting was that search and discovery wasn't contained to just the search and discovery session.
Speaker B:I was hearing it everywhere, even in the supply chain session.
Speaker B:It's going all the way back to that.
Speaker B:I guess the implication of responding to virality, responding to people, are finding things on social media you maybe don't expect.
Speaker B:So how do you have the capacity, and again, agility to respond to that, which, which is a really exciting and dynamic thing for retailers and brands to be grappling with, I guess.
Speaker B:But that's my read of it.
Speaker B:That's what I experienced.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker C:All right, all right, so let's go to Ann.
Speaker C:What was your take?
Speaker A:I.
Speaker A:I think I've, I've heard TikTok shop more in the last three days than I ever have at any retail conference in the last several, for sure months or year.
Speaker A:And I think one of the biggest, biggest takeaways that I heard from that was a session that I did with Mark Elkins, head of E Commerce for l' Oreal and he talked about, you know, how this is something that you have to be involved in and they're testing that in a few ways.
Speaker A:Obviously TikTok shop is a big one for them, but they're also doing things like WhatsApp where they're, they're testing, you know, having the ability to connect one on one with the dermatologist for part of their Dermatologica brand.
Speaker A:They're doing educational videos on YouTube.
Speaker A:They're doing, you know, content on TikTok for that discovery and search kind of happening at the same time.
Speaker A:But I think the most important thing for me as a takeaway and for the audience is that he talked about how expensive it is to feed the content machine and how important it is to make sure that you have a solid strategy because the making that business case work for especially working with creators and then developing your own teams to create that content internally is difficult.
Speaker A:So making sure that you have strong guardrails on how you're setting up your strategy to embark on social commerce.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:Ben, anything you'd add?
Speaker C:It looks like you have something.
Speaker D:I guess probably the one thing that's been really interesting that's happened with the search element in the last two weeks is the big announcement from Google, right?
Speaker D:So many people will have seen that the launch of AI mode and bringing to Magentic AI tools into shopping, that's not live in Europe yet, but it is live in the US And I know you've given this a go so I'd love to hear what you found, how you experienced it, because I think that's super interesting.
Speaker A:Google now has a function called Try it on.
Speaker A:So you're shopping or you're watching TikTok or you see any type of product, you go to search that product in Google, you can in one click tap and try on the product.
Speaker A:So instead of a fit me model that that looks like you or might be the same size as you, this is that product on my body and it is remarkable.
Speaker A:I encourage all of you to check it out or if you haven't seen it yet, my LinkedIn page, if you connect with me, I just put a video out where you can see it and it's unbelievable.
Speaker A:Totally changes the game about things that are going into my cart that I never would have considered because I get to see them.
Speaker A:On me.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:It almost looks too good to be true.
Speaker C:How we talked about it.
Speaker A:Yeah, the legs looked great.
Speaker C:I didn't mean that ad.
Speaker C:I just meant, like, you know, I.
Speaker A:Was like, the clothes.
Speaker C:It almost looks like the clothes fit too good.
Speaker C:And we'll see if that ends up being true once you get them, but, you know, it's pretty impressive for sure.
Speaker D:Okay.
Speaker A:All right, we are going to the next question.
Speaker A:Which store should you ensure is on your future must view list?
Speaker A:Adam, I'm going to you first.
Speaker A:Where are you going?
Speaker B:Interesting.
Speaker B:I think based on what I heard, if I was going to Amsterdam, I would have gone to the House of Rituals.
Speaker B:It sounded amazing.
Speaker B:From what Raymond shared, the Mind Oasis, the store itself looked great.
Speaker B:The restaurants, I think that would be on there.
Speaker B:But I think given I'm not going to Amsterdam, they're bringing Mind Oasis to Oxford street in September, October time.
Speaker B:I think Oxford Street's having a nice moment at the moment with IKEA as well.
Speaker B:So I think a Mind Oasis sounds good.
Speaker B:After three days of shop talks, I.
Speaker A:Already booked my massage.
Speaker A:I'm going to Amsterdam next week.
Speaker A:It's.
Speaker C:You did?
Speaker A:I did.
Speaker A:I did.
Speaker A:Today when Adam was telling me about it, I was like, I gotta check this out.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Chris, what about you?
Speaker A:What's on your next list?
Speaker C:Oh, man.
Speaker C:You know, for this, I'm gonna go kind of.
Speaker C:I'm gonna zag a little bit.
Speaker A:You're gonna zag?
Speaker C:Yeah, I'm gonna zag.
Speaker C:I think the store that I'm gonna check out is actually temu.
Speaker C:Ooh, okay.
Speaker C:And the reason I say that, I sat in Jordan Burke's session yesterday on the rise of Temu and Shein, and he said some pretty interesting things right at the outset, which I was not really aware of.
Speaker C:I mean, I think I kind of was, but I didn't.
Speaker C:I didn't put this on it, which is he said Temu is the fastest growing retailer in history.
Speaker C:And so when you think about that, it's really important to grapple with that and be like, okay, I gotta pay attention to this at least a little bit more than I probably am on a daily basis.
Speaker A:Do you know what you're gonna buy yet?
Speaker C:No.
Speaker A:Is that about product search?
Speaker C:I have no idea, Anne.
Speaker A:Okay, keep you posted.
Speaker D:So I had a couple.
Speaker D:I'm not really gonna give you that because that's not a physical store stretching that one, Chris.
Speaker D:We had a couple of brilliant presentations, one which was from Lego.
Speaker D:So Natalie, who runs LEGO retail globally, talked about what they trying to do to create storytelling within their stores.
Speaker D:And I'm sure many of you have visited some of the Lego flagship stores.
Speaker D:They have fantastic brand flagships.
Speaker D:She talked about their store here in Barcelona on the Sur Amblas and some of the executioners, they do brilliant store.
Speaker D:But I mean the one that really captivated me me was the presentation we had on Tuesday morning from Ellen Swanstrom.
Speaker D:Now she is group chief Digital officer for the H and M Group.
Speaker D:And she talked about the work that they are doing and it really hit one of the big themes in our mind at the moment, which is about how you balance engagement with efficiency.
Speaker D:It was a fantastic case study.
Speaker D:And she talked about their New York City store, the new Soho store and the 10 tech that they've put in there.
Speaker D:And the quote that got me was that they're trying to figure out how can you run a physical retail store with the same information insight that you have on E commerce.
Speaker D:So what are some of the things that you would do on E commerce in terms of creating assortment frequently bought items together?
Speaker D:How can they be able to merchandise the store in a flexible way with frequently viewed together using heat maps?
Speaker D:So not kind of dwell time as you would online, but actually being able to match app where people are moving and flexing the merchandising accordingly and then making sure for the use of rfid they've got much better visibility on inventory in a way that you have when you kind of online, you know.
Speaker D:So that was really interesting how you could both run the store in a more efficient way, but also make it a more engaging experience for the shopper.
Speaker D:So yeah, next time, end of the month when I'm back in New York, I'm definitely going to have a look at that.
Speaker A:Yeah, I've been to the store, I highly recommend it.
Speaker A:Chris and I have been there.
Speaker A:I've taken some several retailers through there and every time it's just unbelievable their reactions to that store.
Speaker A:So definitely check that one out.
Speaker C:Yeah, I mean, it's about operational efficiency because of rfid, but then you also get the customer efficiency too, because you know where everything is and it makes the service level better.
Speaker C:All right, it looks like we're already ahead on the next one.
Speaker C:Oh no, we're not.
Speaker D:Okay.
Speaker C:So how is tech changing the role of retail teams?
Speaker C:Let's go to Ben first on that one.
Speaker D:So we're really proud of having the conversation that we wanted to have on this at the show.
Speaker D:I think it's really important and it's something that we've talked about a lot is that technology is Completely useless if people don't adopt it.
Speaker D:And there is that more so for retail.
Speaker D:Retail is, we talked about this before, it's a scale business.
Speaker D:It's tiny margins and it's huge teams and we want those.
Speaker D:And those teams are the lifeblood of making stuff stores work.
Speaker D:So regardless of what technology you've got, if you haven't got the store teams behind it, then it's not going to work, it's not going to operate.
Speaker D:So it's something that we really wanted to focus on.
Speaker D:Chris, I know you led the panel really deep in diving now.
Speaker C:Yeah, I did.
Speaker C:I think the one thing I'd give kudos to you guys as the Shop Talk content team, this was the first time, I think in all the shop talks which we've attended, which has probably been like over 12 now in total between the two continents.
Speaker C:This was the first time that the focus on the store employee was really palpable.
Speaker C:Like before, it's always been about like, you know, the tech's always taken center stage, but it's been the consumer facing tech.
Speaker C:And yeah, I think on the panel what really stood out to me was and Javier from Tenem said this, I mean, I was pretty impressed with him saying this too.
Speaker C:He said we spent a lot of money on consumer facing tech that just didn't have the roi.
Speaker C:And we've shifted that, we've shifted our focus to focus on, on the impact we can have at the store and we're seeing the roi.
Speaker C:And so ultimately the framework for me is three things.
Speaker C:It's one, you gotta hire staff and retain your employees.
Speaker C:And so that's what Natalia Wallenberg from AJO Delays talked about.
Speaker C:She said they've got the hiring process down to eight minutes.
Speaker C:They can accept or reject an applicant within eight minutes, which is pretty impressive.
Speaker C:Javier talked about then the second part, which is the, the tools the employees need to do their jobs.
Speaker C:And then lastly he also talked about how do you remove the tasks that employees don't want to do.
Speaker C:And so rfid, like in H and M, they're doing the same thing and for all the same reasons.
Speaker C:So that's kind of the framework that I would use to sum up how people were talking about the impact of technology at the store level.
Speaker A:I interviewed Jalma from Tandem also on stage, and he really talked about, and I know it's not going to be a popular opinion with a lot of the retailers in the audience, but he talked about how they're really investing in paying their associates more and training them more.
Speaker A:And I know That's a hard concept right now, especially with margins kind of being flexible, given the uncertainty in the market.
Speaker A:But I think especially with the rise of AI usage, both from a consumer standpoint and in operations at a company, I think it's going to be important as retailers to try to figure out how we find efficiencies through using AI that can help free up some of our resources so that we can train better, so that we can provide a higher level of service, even when we're not a luxury, you know, goods provider.
Speaker A:How do you bring that level of, of service to maybe more of a middle retail price point?
Speaker A:And what does that look like then for your team in the.
Speaker A:And how you're changing your overall operations at a store?
Speaker A:Because I think that's really how you're going to differentiate yourselves in the future.
Speaker B:But I think one thing I would add just from a couple of the store conversations, but some of the change management conversations too, is that we've heard a lot about kind of it's one thing for the VP of retail to say, right, here's this new tool, here's how it's going to work, you're going to use it, we'll do lots of training, et cetera.
Speaker B:But there's a real power into having ambassadors and champions and people who are, you know, on the store floor who are trained on this stuff that, you know, really well versed in it and they train their peers.
Speaker B:Yes, they're more receptive to it, they understand it better, they understand the realities of using it, what the challenges are, what the opportunities are, rather than it being kind of dictated or forced from above down to the, the shop floor.
Speaker B:So I think there's something to be said for, you know, kind of like clusters of people who then go around and train regionally and things like that.
Speaker A:Because it's more powerful.
Speaker A:Yeah, like you're investing in the total experience of your, of your associates.
Speaker C:Well, it's funny too, because we actually talked about that in the panel in the 15 seconds we have left where we said, like, you know, the consumer facing technologies, if they work, you start jumping in them as fast as you can.
Speaker C:That's what retail is all about.
Speaker C:You find something that works, you go after it.
Speaker C:The funny thing is the same thing happens at the store level because the stores start talking about it and they want it too, and then they go after it.
Speaker C:All right, nice job.
Speaker C:We covered a lot of ground in that.
Speaker D:We got it.
Speaker B:All right, we've got a buzzer.
Speaker A:All right, the next one, Best insight and Favorite session from the keynote stage.
Speaker B:Adam, it's you that's unfair to put me on the spot first.
Speaker B:I can't be biased, but I guess I have to be.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker B:I would say Michael Ward, the managing director from Harrods, was my personal favorite session.
Speaker B:And I think what I enjoyed about it most was that there was some quite nice surprise elements to it.
Speaker B:I think you have a perception of Harrods as a very kind of established heritage British brand.
Speaker B:You know, very, very traditional in some senses.
Speaker B:But from what Michael shared, they are very, very advanced in data analytics, AI, you know, doing some really cool and innovative stuff that maybe people wouldn't automatically assume or expect.
Speaker B:I think he made that nice reference about the fact that he was a little bit of a Luddite himself, maybe wasn't quite as down with the tech as he wanted to be.
Speaker B:So he took himself off to Oxford for a AI course, which I thought was great.
Speaker B:And actually he did say offstage.
Speaker B:I think he even dabbled with some Python and some coding one, which is.
Speaker B:Which is pretty cool.
Speaker B:So I thought that was a really cool surprise.
Speaker B:That was really interesting.
Speaker B:But what I loved most about it, all of that said, was that they've built all of these capabilities, but they switch it off when the buyers go in the rooms to select merchandise.
Speaker B:And for him, that is all around how well those buyers are trained.
Speaker B:Their eye for detail, their eye for style, what they know their customers are looking for even before they do.
Speaker B:And despite all of the capabilities they've built, they think they can do that better without it.
Speaker B:I think is a really interesting challenge that he posed to the audience that would be mine.
Speaker A:These two are like giving eyes back to each other.
Speaker A:So why don't you say what I disagree?
Speaker C:Well, I mean.
Speaker C:I mean, I definitely noted when he said that I wrote it in my.
Speaker C:I took notes on that too.
Speaker C:But I think there's two issues I have with it.
Speaker C:One, I think it's what we as retailers want to tell ourselves, those of us that have been in the business for 25 plus years, as I have now, and even longer.
Speaker C:And, like, because it just makes us feel good.
Speaker C:And as a merchant, too, particularly, it makes you feel good as a merchant that you still have value.
Speaker C:So it's kind of like, yes, somebody said it.
Speaker C:But at the same time, the other point I'd make is it's one store, and running one store that way is very different than running a chain like many of you in this room have or are a part of, of sending product to.
Speaker C:So I'm a little cautious on buying coming out of this show and saying that's the approach we should take overall and follow his example.
Speaker C:But I don't know.
Speaker C:That's just me.
Speaker D:Okay.
Speaker D:All right, let's pull you back from one end of the extreme to the other.
Speaker D:So I had the privilege of interviewing Mark Karena on the stage.
Speaker D:And I don't say that just because he sat there.
Speaker D:It was genuinely a really, really great conversation.
Speaker D:And Mark leads the European business for Mars snacking.
Speaker D:And so there are 50.
Speaker D:Mars Inc.
Speaker D:Is a 50 billion global.
Speaker D:It's one of the biggest CPGs and it's one of actually the world's biggest private companies.
Speaker D:So it was a privilege.
Speaker D:Their leaders as a private company don't speak on many large platforms.
Speaker D:So we got to interrogate a number of things.
Speaker D:We talked about the growth ambition of Mars Snacking, which is to go from a 20 billion business to a 30 billion business from 23 to 30.
Speaker D:There's not many CPGs you talk to with that level of ambition.
Speaker D:We talked about the double digit growth that they're delivering in Europe.
Speaker D:There's not many established CPGs doing that level of growth.
Speaker D:And we talk about how.
Speaker D:And that's where the insights came from.
Speaker D:What, what really took me was that Mark talked about mental and physical availability, which was a really interesting phrase.
Speaker D:So you know, retailers, the great especially the grocers and CPGs in the room.
Speaker D:He used to drive.
Speaker D:I'm really mindful of the clocks.
Speaker D:I'm going to go quick.
Speaker D:You're used to driving physical availability.
Speaker D:Point of sale.
Speaker D:You want to get your product out there.
Speaker D:But this idea of mental availability, how do you keep your, your brands front of mind and that's transferable for everyone.
Speaker D:And Mark shared that Mars now spends 60 to 70% of their global media spend is digital.
Speaker D:Really similar numbers in a conversation I had with Jordi Bosch.
Speaker D:She leads commercial globally for nestle.
Speaker D:That was 70%.
Speaker D:And we talk with Mark around how they're bringing down paid and replacing it with earned and shared.
Speaker D:I mean that's a really interesting idea to keep your brands at the forefront.
Speaker D:So that was my takeaway.
Speaker D:How do you actively bring down the amount you're investing in paid and how do you increase earned and shared?
Speaker D:I thought it was really interesting.
Speaker C:Nicely done.
Speaker B:Nicely done.
Speaker C:Wow.
Speaker B:Good.
Speaker C:All right.
Speaker C:Biggest surprise of the show.
Speaker C:Adam, why don't we go back to you me again.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:And you kind of alluded to it, but TikTok and TikTok shop.
Speaker B:The biggest surprise in, in a couple of ways one just how hot it is right now.
Speaker B:TikTok shop.
Speaker B:Everyone wants to talk about it, everyone wants to understand it.
Speaker B:People that are on it, enjoying their experimentations with it and getting good results from it.
Speaker B:And I think, you know, that probably underlined why that room was quite so busy yesterday as well as, you know, Laurie Ellen Vault.
Speaker B:But I think people wanted to hear TikTok shop and sort of how disruptive it is.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:People are trying to work this thing out along with other emerging platforms of course, but what does it mean for us from a marketing perspective?
Speaker B:What does it mean from a CX perspective and as I said before, what does it mean for operations and supply chain?
Speaker B:How do we actually deal with this stuff?
Speaker B:So that was my big surprise.
Speaker B:I think the main thing for me was that I think I had that kind of, of misconception that TikTok TikTok shop is maybe for younger people, entirely younger people.
Speaker B:Maybe you're young.
Speaker A:You're young.
Speaker B:Yeah, ish, youngish comparatively, I don't know.
Speaker B:And also the fact that the brands on there I assumed were kind of, you know, plucky upstarts, disruptive beauty etc, but you know, some of the examples they shared were like family owned gardening companies in the UK and the average age of people shopping on there was over 35, which I, I just did not expect or know.
Speaker A:Yeah, well I think the interesting thing is like search, it goes back to the search and discovery changing.
Speaker A:Like the TikTok content pops up on a search when you're searching for how do I care for this type of plant?
Speaker A:Or where's this type of plant nearest me?
Speaker A:Like that's that content is being served up to people.
Speaker A:That's how they're searching and discovering.
Speaker A:So whether they know it or not, you know, they're getting fed some of the stuff that's being created and served up first on TikTok.
Speaker A:I completely agree, Adam.
Speaker A:I think the thing that Jan Wilk in that the head of TikTok shops was talking about in that session was that all businesses online and offline are drafting off of TikTok.
Speaker A:And I thought that was really an important note to think about.
Speaker A:So it is the mom and pop businesses that you know, when a product goes viral they have to be ready for people to come and pick up as many of those or clean them out of a product.
Speaker A:And how do you, how do you get supply chain back up and running when those types of viral moments are happening?
Speaker A:So I think that was, that was a huge, huge impactful statement for me that everybody Needs to be paying attention to TikTok and TikTok shops.
Speaker C:So TikTok shop.
Speaker C:TikTok shops.
Speaker C:Always hard to say is winning shop talk.
Speaker C:Okay, Ben, did you have the same thing or are you going to go in a different direction?
Speaker C:You're going to zag this time?
Speaker D:No, I mean.
Speaker D:Well, my biggest surprise of the show is that Adam just called me old live on stage.
Speaker D:Right?
Speaker D:Yeah, it was subtle.
Speaker B:It was in subtle.
Speaker B:I didn't say was subtle.
Speaker D:How quickly you can go off some people implicit, I think, look, I'm going to move on from TikTok short, but I'm still going to talk about somebody from a similar ilk.
Speaker D:And that's about Shein.
Speaker D:A really interesting conversation with Shein on Tuesday afternoon and we were talking about how Shein is expanding and growing his business.
Speaker D:So I don't think I had the level of insight at the time.
Speaker D:Same speed at which and along with T, along with AliExpress are moving their business, their sourcing models to local sourcing models and doing it in Europe, especially as trade in the US for all the reasons that we've talked about earlier is getting harder for these businesses.
Speaker D:So they're moving super fast.
Speaker D:And the surprising fact that I learned was for Sheen in Spain, as they're setting up a broader marketplace beyond clothing, that pretty much their fastest growing category has been automotive.
Speaker D:That was a real surprise for me.
Speaker D:Now, we clarified that by automotive, it doesn't mean selling cars.
Speaker D:It's accessories.
Speaker D:So it's things to go around your steering wheel stickers, accessories.
Speaker D:I found that really surprising.
Speaker D:But when I said this to you when we were chatting earlier, you said maybe not.
Speaker D:Maybe not.
Speaker C:That's where like as much as the TEMU and Shein story's out there, there's still a part of me that's really skeptical and having trouble understanding it fully.
Speaker C:Yeah, I think it's important to keep talking about, but yeah, but that first of all, the desire to go local makes sense given the pressures they're under macroeconomically.
Speaker C:But at the end of the day, it's just a marketplace of a different color, which if you look at the marketplaces that have been stood up typically, I know this is the case in Mexico, like when they stand up market like a department store stands up a marketplace there, the first things they start seeing sell are automotive supplies like tires, cup holders, things like that.
Speaker C:Things that are hard to find.
Speaker C:So some of this is just a natural extension of how the consumer shops.
Speaker C:And so I'm curious, you know, what to make of that.
Speaker A:All right, next category.
Speaker A:The tech talk of the town.
Speaker A:What was the tech that you felt like was most discussed at this shop talk?
Speaker A:Ben, start us off.
Speaker D:Yeah, no surprise for me it was agentic AI.
Speaker D:And I think, I think it's kind of interesting.
Speaker D:I think we've talked for a while and there's been almost a realization that there's two perspectives on agentic AI.
Speaker D:So one perspective is the consumer facing.
Speaker D:So whether this whole idea of agentic commerce, but also how you link multiple things together to help automate elements of the shopping journey.
Speaker D:And then the second section is automation in terms of process and driving process efficiency within retail organizations and all consumer brand organizations of finding routes to be able to take cost out doing that.
Speaker D:I mean we've started to hear a number of case studies.
Speaker D:So retailers are genuinely now using a jinchim we've been talked about, I mean Amazon were talking about the amount they've been saving to getting a jinch to do coding to code automate.
Speaker D:And this is in, I mean the same 200 million they saved last year for using agentic AI code, which is a mind blogging amount to consider how much they were spending on coding.
Speaker D:But by automating it, but also adding in the documentation and adding in the check.
Speaker D:I think we talked a lot about the potential of consumer facing and a lot of that had remained quite theoretical up till two weeks ago when Google said actually we're doing it.
Speaker D:But the agentic elements of what Google is doing in AI mode are not live yet.
Speaker D:So the idea that once you've done your try on your basket, you can now ask the agent to buy it for you.
Speaker D:It acts as your shopping disk, your payment details.
Speaker D:If it's in Google Wallet, it knows where you live and it takes care of that.
Speaker D:It finds the best price and tracks the best price for you.
Speaker D:Again, if you haven't seen it, have a look because I think it's really interesting to see some of the things we've been talking about as being futuristic.
Speaker D:It's coming at scale really soon.
Speaker D:This ain't the metaverse.
Speaker D:This is going to be happening really, really soon.
Speaker D:At scale.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Volt was on stage also talking about how in their search queries they're already seeing people asking questions and they don't even have that functionality fully built in, but they're already seeing people go to the app and search, what can I make for dinner tonight that's gluten free?
Speaker A:And like they're doing the best to serve up or like, yeah, can I order a Pizza.
Speaker A:And it's like, do we serve up pizza, pizza flavored products or do we order, get you a pizza to order?
Speaker A:Like those kinds of things are already behaviors that people are using.
Speaker A:And then Mark Elkins from L' Oreal also said that like they're having to change PDPs right now.
Speaker A:They're having to think about not just what, you know, what are the product specs for this product, but how do they put in keywords like, you know, if somebody's going, saying, I'm going to Barcelona, what's the best sun protection SPF lotion that I can get?
Speaker A:That sort of data is not currently in the metadata set and they need to start thinking about making sure that products are assigned to those types of language based queries, not just SPF 30 lotion.
Speaker A:Ben, we covered you.
Speaker C:Chris, what are your thoughts on tech?
Speaker C:Yeah, I mean, for me, you know, as a former store manager and executive merchant at Target, I think, you know, the thing I took solace in was the fact that, and particularly over here in Europe because it's much more advanced than it is in the States, actually having people on stage talking about the value of digital shelf labels, rfid, like there's still a lot of room for those to grow over on the other side of the Atlantic.
Speaker C:So it was really warming, heartwarming, quite honestly, to see that happening, particularly because of the impact it has on the store associates.
Speaker A:All right, Adam, anything else you want to add?
Speaker B:I think Agentic AI has kind of won the day, hasn't it?
Speaker D:All right, 10 seconds left.
Speaker D:I want to give a call out to our two startup pitch winners.
Speaker D:So ShopEx won the audience choice, which is a social shop, engagement intent platform.
Speaker D:And Amoeba AI, which is supply chain AI won the Gen Judges choice.
Speaker D:So congratulations to them both.
Speaker C:Nicely done, nicely done.
Speaker C:All right, last one, Your top insight and favorite session of the show.
Speaker C:Let's go to Ann.
Speaker C:Why don't you start us off on that one.
Speaker A:So I, I, one of my favorite and most memorable insights was during Carla's session from WGSN when she was talking about consumer trends for the year ahead.
Speaker A:And she talked about this concept of spaving, which is a hybrid of spending and saving and talking about the consumer and how they're kind of thinking about spending more to save more, kind of trying to hit it hit on this theme of championing slower consumption.
Speaker A:Even though Holden came in right after and was like, Gen Z is virtue signaling this, but the, you know, their sustainability.
Speaker A:But the top five apps in Europe include Temu, she in and others in the top five.
Speaker A:But I think it's interesting this concept of even spending just a little bit more to get something that will last a little bit longer.
Speaker A:And it makes me kind of question if that doesn't provide some opportunity or revival for some of the mall based brands or the department stores that are kind of middle of the road right now and if people will start to migrate more towards that.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker D:I mean if that's going to be the savior of the US Department store, I think that's as a wildly optimistic.
Speaker A:It's very optimistic.
Speaker D:But I think it's and I really like you mentioned the Holden Bale.
Speaker D:Yeah, it was a great presentation.
Speaker D:What he shared was the great contradiction that continues to be had between what shoppers do and what shoppers say.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker D:We always look for that in the research and we've heard for a decade plus now that younger shoppers want more sustainable choices, yet the behaviors don't reflect that.
Speaker D:So at some point that contradiction might change.
Speaker D:But there's nothing in the evidence to suggest they're not going to continue to say they're going to want more sustainable choices but still continue to spend with fashion, et cetera.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:And the point I would add to that too.
Speaker C:And then Adam, we'll go to you to close it out for your favorite.
Speaker C:But you know, again going back to Sheen and Timu, the other quote I took from that conversation with Jordan Burke is he said the success of their strategy was not about borders but or taking advantage of tax loopholes.
Speaker C:It was about customer behavior.
Speaker C:That's fundamentally what's going on there is the customer wants that product on demand and they want to get it that way.
Speaker C:And so whether we let, whether she and Timu become the powerhouses that enable the customers to do that in the long run or the retailers themselves start to figure out ways to do that through technology and coordination with their own manufacturers that need state is there and that's the important thing to recognize.
Speaker C:And I thought Jordan did a really great job of calling that out.
Speaker C:So.
Speaker C:So Adam, take us home.
Speaker B:Yeah, so I think my, my favorite standout insight and I'm not just saying this because and you were the moderator but Jarma Mikhail, the CEO of Ten Dam, he it was really interesting to hear a CEO speak so, so clearly and sort of logically around the power of loyalty and unified commerce.
Speaker B:And he broke it down in such a cool way that it was really interesting.
Speaker B:So tandem have 12 fashion brands.
Speaker B:He spoke about, you know, how they've invested in data capabilities and their loyalty schemes in really unifying the online offline experience.
Speaker B:And he shared how typically the average customer used to spend, I think it was €37.
Speaker B:And then once you add in, make them a member of one loyalty scheme, it goes up to like 45 or something.
Speaker B:Once they do one loyalty scheme plus another, plus a different channel, it's 50 something.
Speaker B:And by the end of this pyramid that he shared, once you use multiple channels, three plus loyalty schemes and shop across three plus brands, it goes up to €188, like five times the value of that customer by getting them through your mechanics and getting their data and personalizing all that stuff.
Speaker B:And I just thought to hear a CEO at that level speak then to that granularity, I've not really heard that before, personally.
Speaker B:It's just a really nice way to illustrate the value of loyalty done well.
Speaker B:I really like that.
Speaker D:I'm going to race through.
Speaker D:20 seconds.
Speaker D:Claude Sorel, CEO for Europe for all Delairs interviewed.
Speaker D:First day we, we talked about the role of stores in engaging and being efficient.
Speaker D:And the key point, if you're going to make your stores exciting and enticing, you've got to really manage the price perception.
Speaker C:Nicely done.
Speaker A:Well done.
Speaker A:Well, that concludes the rapid fire.
Speaker A:Ben, why don't you share with everybody, tell them what they've won.
Speaker A:Ben, next year, what's ahead, what's ahead.
Speaker D:So really quick, thank you everybody for joining us.
Speaker D:Thank you for staying to the bitter end, but we really appreciate everybody's involvement, all your engagement and the fact you've joined us in Barcelona this week.
Speaker D:We'll be back 9th to 11th of June, next year back here, including the new market.
Speaker D:Something a bit special, but no, best of luck.
Speaker D:Safe travels everybody and thank you for joining us.
Speaker B:Thank you.
Speaker A:All right, thank you so much.
Speaker A:And as we conclude every podcast, Chris.
Speaker C:Be careful out there.
